My 10cts

[Petrus]

The latest from China have done away with the half ferrules; thát I can live with

 

[Petrus]

The Vespa weekend was PARTYYYYY.... Local police and guardia civil was presen to control the rést of traffic, ignored grossly uprated Vespas wheelying

We met two riders from Sao Paulo Brasil who stayed at the same hostal. Both avid Harley riders. The why being... because; all have one, lost of dealers, image. One had a shirt boasting ´BMW Killer´ so I asked him about that. Turns out that BMWs are perceived as a competetive ´threat´. He totally agreed that it is a Harley thing, that the BMW world does not see Harley as competition.
Nobody of sound mind going on a world trip or such opts for a Harley. All go BMW GS or Honda.
Bottom line; the Harley family thing is thé selling point, not the bikes themselves.

Anyway, travelling back we passed monestry ruins. A 16th c. place of warship (pun intended), half hacked out into the rock, on the site og a 9th mexquita, on the site of a 5th c. visigoth water sanctuary.
Very well fenced and signposted prohibited entry. So we entered and

 

[Petrus]

Bought the Chinese heel shifter pedal. Should be here end of the month or so. Eta is the 27th and it is usually early.

 

[BAD MIKE USA]

Bought the Chinese heel shifter pedal. Should be here end of the month or so. Eta is the 27th and it is usually early.

Did you also get the Chinese reverse lever? Is it like the Wunderlich one?

 

[Petrus]

Did you also get the Chinese reverse lever? Is it like the Wunderlich one?

Indeed the Chinese reverse lever. Photos earlier in this thread. Both of the product and fitted.
No it is nothing like the Wünderlich version. That one is an axle extention with cross bar. The Chinese one is more like a tank shift lever.
I suppose they work equally well, just liked the shifter look a lot better. Sofar it works a treat and I think using it über : It is indeed properly shífting a gear.

 

[Petrus]

Meanwhile on the Sprint filter I ordered and payed for have received no confirmation data so contacted the seller. They are very sorry not to have contacted me but have currently no stock.
Not deeply impressed.

The manufacturer Sprint located in Riga, Latvia makes very high quality products so I hope they will not be let down by a distributer.

Shipping luck is currently not on my side btw as the 100 year gift box is stuck/lost in transition.
DHL plays stumm and fingers crossed the seller can chase them or offer an alternative solution.

 

[BAD MIKE USA]

Meanwhile on the Sprint filter I ordered and payed for have received no confirmation data so contacted the seller. They are very sorry not to have contacted me but have currently no stock.
Not deeply impressed.

The manufacturer Sprint located in Riga, Latvia makes very high quality products so I hope they will not be let down by a distributer.

Shipping luck is currently not on my side btw as the 100 year gift box is stuck/lost in transition.
DHL plays stumm and fingers crossed the seller can chase them or offer an alternative solution.

Not exactly on subject but, I am cautious about ordering from Latvia. Am I wrong?

 

[Petrus]

Not exactly on subject but, I am cautious about ordering from Latvia. Am I wrong?

Yes you are wrong. Latvia is a totally modern state in all but military spending surpassing the US. My son went there from Sweden and found that all speak at least three languages. Also no shipping/customs issues unlike with US p.e.

A short list of my personal experiences:
- The three baltic states and Poland are nowadays quite strong in the motoring industry after market. Top notch service.
- Sofar I rate those above Germany whom I rate above ther rest. That only because I have only a few experiences with Romania and Bulagaria. Those were good to
- Sweden again limited experience but top notch.
- Sadly the UK is now off my shopping list because of Brexit and the US is off because of TrumpTariffs.
- Japan requires special mention. Buying in Japan is a major pita but when you have found the path, the logistics of shipping blows one away.
- China has a special trade agreement with EU and with Spain in particular. I do not know the details but all comes through EU based distribution centers free of customs. It most times takes a bit longer but always beats the given eta.

Back to thís order, I ordered from the Spanish distributer. I expect the filter to now come directly from Latvia.
About Spanish sellers, I have a lot of dealings with Vespa stuff and all are A+ with a kiss from the teacher.

Have a look at the Sprint Latvian website btw. https://sprintfilter.com

 

[Petrus]

as I observed not my lucky week; the reverse gear mod. was not much of a thing here but I díd receive a recall notice about it from MoT. Best to have it done even though it is a major Pita. Related my ´displeasure´ to the selling dealer. Contacted the nearest dealer. Afaik it involves fitting a sturdier relais and updating software. Should be while I wait job no?! If not it will be a It is not the distance as that is only 50 kms but that makes no difference; you are still stuck at the dealer.

 

[Petrus]

Two positives:
The bike doés have the reverse mod. it just was not updated in the MoT database.
The Latvian Sprint filter makers will get the filter here by Wednesday.

As observed in the pre-load adjustment thread, re-adjusted after some more distance on the bike. Set is 4 revs lighter and it is indeed just a bit smoother. Imo better and the charming passenger says she was ok with it and is still ok. Win-win I say.

I commented on it earlier and repeat that on the Bridgestones my bike´s front end is very sensitive to the tyre pressure. Have adjusted the current ´cold´ pressure.

Am still grappling with properly understánding the effects of low cog, the moment of inertia, wheel base and steering geometry on the handling

 

[Petrus]

Coming back on the handling of the R18 Beast.
The motorcycling industry does not have an equivalent of like the Milliken Reseach. Also the publications are generally not digging deep to not say simplistic.
The motorcycling press adds insult upon injury by writing plenitudes based on fast impressions with a non-perspective of lacking knowledge.
As such there is witten mostly crap on the R18 handling. Like the low center of gravity making it easy handling. For one there is no mention ever of the moment of inertia of the big cilinders sticking way out. Secondly the low cog in combination with a long wheel base is the wórst scenario for quick handling. Ergo nonsense.

Riding the beast, I find it indeed needs to be cranked over fúrther and needs turning of the hanlebars. The latter has a tricky effect of the bike wanting to fall into the corner. One effect is that the bike is usually understeered but at lower speeds can almost binairy turn oversteered.

I am aware of having OCD concerning understanding of a bike´s handling and my excuse is that this results in awareness of how it will respond to my actions. I.e. avoid surprises cuaes by the inherent properties of the particular bike. The weight of the R18 makes that a literally heavier weighing priority.

From my library I dug out a very good if head ache causing book on the matter;
Motorcycle Design; how and why - Gaetano Cocco.



As far as Í know it is the most comprehensive and most in deph publication on the subjet.
Because it treats the prínciples of ALL of the various aspects, they can all be easily applied to different kinds of motorcycles.
Furthermore it explains the basics of each aspect and goes gradually deeper untill it gets to pages of formulae about the geometry and forces.
One example is an easy to understand illustration and explanation of how/why a motorcycle takes longer to change direction, to take an avoiding path than a car.

It is quite widely and cheaply availeble.

Right. Now back to the under- vs oversteer

 

[BAD MIKE USA]

My impression of the bike is the side to side twisting force of the engine gives me a feeling that I am unfamilar with. With time, I have gotten used to it and really enjoy the feeling of power when the engine twists. Unique to my riding experiences. Like riding a wild beast!

 

[Petrus]

My impression of the bike is the side to side twisting force of the engine gives me a feeling that I am unfamilar with. With time, I have gotten used to it and really enjoy the feeling of power when the engine twists. Unique to my riding experiences. Like riding a wild beast!

That ´twisting force´ is the reaction force to moment of inertia with larger rev changes. It indeed feels realy cool like an awakening beast upon starting.
On the move it should be minimal in the lower gears and neglectable in higher.

Because the crankshaft and drive are lengthwise, the gyroscopic effect (resisting the changes of direction/angle) is absent when changing direction.

 

[Noelpolar]

I'm pre programmed from the late 60's and early 70's, when as a child between the age of 6 to 15 you rode, made/built and mostly destroyed every two wheel thing without any written understanding of much. Just about everything was ridable and fun with right attitude, enough speed and risky thrills.

The biggest laugh for me is when people talk about counter steering like it's a thing. My monkey brain worked that out in the first hour of bicycle riding (falling off) as a 6yo.

 

[Petrus]

The biggest laugh for me is when people talk about counter steering like it's a thing. My monkey brain worked that out in the first hour of bicycle riding (falling off) as a 6yo.

´Countersteering´ is subconscious. It is why some take longer than others to learn cycling. I learned it the old way; by being given a push and fall untill not

I also ride sidecar and there is nothing better to get aware of the difference between single track and double track vehicles: The sidecar steers like a car but instantly changes to a motorcycle when you lift the chair. It is why unexperienced side car riders initially wobble a lot when they lift the wheel. Akin learning to ride a bicycle.

Even though countersteering is part of riding a single track vehicle I cannot see it as a conscious avoidance technique on a motorbike because the weight will make recovery impossible.

A question; has anyone found an overview of the steering geometry of the R18?
Not just wheelbase but also the off set of the fork and the angle. The fork stanchions are not parallel to the steering head.
I suspect that the socalled ´drop´ (when moving the handlebars left or right, the head stock thus bike lowers) is of huge influence because of the weight of the bike. You can see this when turning the bars from all left to all right with the bike on the side stand.
So we have several typical aspects for the R18:
the long wheel base and low center of gravity slowing steering down
the low cog asks for more angle of lean for the same cornering speed
the high angular moment of the cilinders slows changes down
and what happens with p.e. the drop at the front end is still obtuse for me.

My appologies for this OCD. It really rocks my boat.

 

[Petrus]

meanwhile



I am going for the finest mesh.
Needs a bit of fine tuning and I will spray paint the aluminium base on the case cover black. On the other (left) side there are no cables and the total extra aperture is about the same as three slits in the front cover.

Because there is also an open air entry at the top on the covers, under the tank around the motor mount and cable entry, the side opening introduces no new downsides; it is just more air entry. In fact, they have mesh whereas the top opening is unobstructed.



Also the filter cover has quite a few holes added to it and these openings are a clear indications that the engineers wánted to let the air from the top opening into the filter housing. I suspect they will simply leave the cover closed, thus with no holes, for further induction noise reduction.




I will decide whether to let the filter cover off or enlarge the openings when I replace the filter and can have a lóók at it.
The way I (not) see it now, I will add a largish hole in the middle of the flat top. Will also just leave out the two rubber harmonica connections to the front.

For good understanding of the front air entry, look at the photo with the front engine cover off which I placed earlier. The plastic intake noise mufflers can be easily felt by poking a finger in the intake slits.

 

[Petrus]

Also meanwhile, the 100 years gift box was sent back to the seller and the seller refunded. Beats me why the parcel was not deleivered. Either the seller did not get the delivery address right or most likely DHL could not be @rsed dealing with village life: One drop off adress had road works in front and the other fiesta!!!! Not a problem. Something I would have líked but not need. I have the First Edition kit.

 

[Petrus]

...and a step back to the inspiration for the R18; the R5. It had a foot shifter pedal but as that was rather innovative and the motorcyclists a conservative market, they also provided a hand lever. Yes, I knew and it is why I went the Chinese reverse lever.

 

[Red64]

meanwhile

View attachment 19266View attachment 19267

I am going for the finest mesh.
Needs a bit of fine tuning and I will spray paint the aluminium base on the case cover black. On the other (left) side there are no cables and the total extra aperture is about the same as three slits in the front cover.

Because there is also an open air entry at the top on the covers, under the tank around the motor mount and cable entry, the side opening introduces no new downsides; it is just more air entry. In fact, they have mesh whereas the top opening is unobstructed.

View attachment 19268

Also the filter cover has quite a few holes added to it and these openings are a clear indications that the engineers wánted to let the air from the top opening into the filter housing. I suspect they will simply leave the cover closed, thus with no holes, for further induction noise reduction.

View attachment 19269


I will decide whether to let the filter cover off or enlarge the openings when I replace the filter and can have a lóók at it.
The way I (not) see it now, I will add a largish hole in the middle of the flat top. Will also just leave out the two rubber harmonica connections to the front.

For good understanding of the front air entry, look at the photo with the front engine cover off which I placed earlier. The plastic intake noise mufflers can be easily felt by poking a finger in the intake slits.

the 3D Printed pieces look great. Still working on getting the desktop CNC. would you be willing to share the 3D file? Either STL or STP? The desktop CNC offers some different options. Of course can mill out of an aluminum blank but there are also some interesting 2 Colour plastics and also aluminum plastic sandwich boards used for signage. For mine I was thinking of replacing the 1800 lettering with an own wording and surround it with a honeycomb mesh similar to what you have done.

Cheers

 

[Petrus]

the 3D Printed pieces look great.

Thanks will tell my son.

These are the functional examples in El Cheapo material.
He has taken the original ´1800cc´ with him to fine tune dimentions.
Next he will print in high quality temp. resistant filament.
With a bit of luck I will have the finished articles by the end of the month so...
... to be continued.